Replies to This Discussion

Permalink Reply by mac Sperry on June 21, 2012 at 1:38pm

Mike

Actually, any and all present systems can be rigged in one way or another. In my opinion electronic machines would do just fine if operated with a sense of integrity, of course, that is not about to happen. Ballots are better, but certainly not a panacea.

Focusing in on the "ballot/electronic" end of the argument, the "content" end, serves to distract most people from the highly productive side of things, "verification". With verification comes the certainty the election was rigged, something that will stand up in court, something that will cause a rerun. That's what we should be focusing on instead of dealing in those things that distract us from the truly important issue, verification/mac

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Permalink Reply by pa mike on June 23, 2012 at 1:48am

Hey everyone. Sorry Joyce, it's not that I don't care or didn't return. I couldn't return until just now. This issue is one of many issues stealing our Rights and Freedoms from under our feet.

The reason I favor the old fashioned paper ballots is that they can be in-place today. And they are simple enough for stupid people to understand. How long for the vva type of voting to be studied, approved, budgeted, ordered, delivered, and certified training to be in-use at the voting locations? Not to discredit the idea, I like it and had something similar in mind. But the election is here already. I don't care if we had multiple systems, just as long as it was honest. Might even throw them off guard and catch the cheats out.

As you know, we have no time to waste. I like the idea of getting both parties on board to make "something" happen. I've seen both sides rigging the elections then point at each other. They're both bitter. We've got a crooked Congress and a dictator in chief, and a justice department that will not seek justice. Plus we're broke by design! We're out of time, and that is our biggest hurdle. So, I don't want to slow down progress, what's the next steps? Making things happen is crucial.

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Permalink Reply by Chancy Yardbird on June 23, 2012 at 10:40am

TALLAHASSEE, Fla. — Lawyers for President Barack Obama and Gov. Rick Scott's administration asked a judge Monday to dismiss a ballot challenge that alleges Obama is not a "natural born citizen."

Circuit Judge Terry Lewis did not immediately rule. He gave lawyers on both sides a week to submit proposed orders.

The lawsuit by Fort Lauderdale automobile salesman Michael Voeltz asks that Obama be removed from the state's 2012 ballot.

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Permalink Reply by Chancy Yardbird on June 23, 2012 at 10:56am

"that Obama be removed from the state's 2012 ballot" Amazing that National Elections ARE still State by State processes where each state makes their own voting laws and holds their own polls with the equipment, and even ballots they each choose. All as per the Constitution that demands when the presidential elections MUST be held, and the process for sellecting state electors, and leaving nearly everything else up to the states and the peoples.

Permalink Reply by mac Sperry on June 23, 2012 at 1:56pm

This is to PaMike, Magnus, Clancy Yardbird and Joyce

All of your posts in the last 16 hours have alluded to the idea that  while Vva looks like a good idea, it cannot rise above all the hurdles in front of it in time for the election.

I'm Mac Sperry the developer of Vva and I'm here to tell you: "There are no hurdles" - - Did you actually read the last of the three short articles contained in "Why You Can't Vote Them Out"? That article detailed Vva. Below is an excerpt you should consider:

" It would not require permission or license of government, since it is an independent check of that government. As such it would be independent of the Registrar of Voters. "

It shouldn't be necessary to get permission to do a Vva. It isn't necessary for those doing exit polls to get permission, why should it be for you.

On the same page at: http://howtorescueamerica.org is the protocol for conducting a Vva. Here is the url for that protocol and below are some excepts: http://howtorescueamerica.org/jefferson.html

"Think of the Voter verified audit as a citizen conducted “exit poll,” on steroids. Though exit polls can detect vote irregularities within a narrow margin (typically +/-5%), their sampling methods could very well amount to “hearsay” in a court of law. The Vva has been designed to replace this shortcoming with a far more robust system of verification and authentication, that starts by sampling the vote in front of a witness (the voter) at the point of origin (in the voting booth), rather than sampling on exit. "

"F) Out of all that must be done to deploy a Vva, probably the one thing that would require the greatest lead-time is the printing of the multi page receipt. "

If you follow the protocol the lead time to conduct a Vva in all precincts for your city should be less than three weeks and in a rush as little as ten days. You need no ones permission except possibly the neighbours adjoining the polling place where your table will be set up. The total cost should be negligible.

In short, Vva can be done and done easily this election. Make no mistake about it, you can take back America 18 weeks from now without a shot ever being fired.  Just keep that in mind/mac

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Permalink Reply by pa mike on June 23, 2012 at 2:30pm

Hi Mac. Yes I did read those articles and I want you to go full steam ahead with your vva. I'm expecting opposition from those who don't want a fair election, and they are many. I think they will do whatever needs to be done to trip you up. Mostly stalling and spinning your wheels. Keep in mind that Soros has the monopoly on the system we have in place already. He's not going to give it up to anyone. he's holding all the cards. Do we need to start a campaign to discredit his involvement with OUR elections? I owe you an apology if it sounds like I'm against your efforts and hard work. You are part of the solution, so keep going. I prefer to have a back up plan just in case. Maybe I'm paranoid, maybe you'll prove me wrong. I hope so, and I will buy you dinner if I am. I so much want to be wrong.

So, let's get you going. What's the next step to get these into the districts? Who's ear do we need to get to make it happen? How do we get Soros out?

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Permalink Reply by mac Sperry on June 23, 2012 at 11:25pm

pa mike

You said: "What's the next step to get these into the districts?" - - It is this: You've got to get the word out! Once people start to see some movement forward more will jump on board. Other than that, the protocol explains everything else.

The first two sentences of the protocol are: "Initiation of a Vva begins in each county with one person. It is important that one person be from a minor political party-(or independent). Indeed, the first three people should be from different minor parties."(or independents)

You could be that seed in your county. Just get going and I predict there will be oodles of people including lawyers who will offer you help, something easy to see when you consider the appeal of Vva to the average person. Why? Because Vva is an incredibly cost effective way to peacefully take back their country in 14 hours flat, without a single shot being fired!

Go to the civic organizations and give them copies of the protocol and ask if they'd help. Especially organizations with heavy numbers of vets. And don't forget the Libertarians and all the minor parties.

Further, if Ron Paul fails at the Convention, then ran as an "independent" write-in candidate, he can only prevail if a Vva  is  conducted. The vote would be rigged against him otherwise. In other words, Ron Paul doesn't have a snow balls chance without a Vva, but Vva has to be in place to make it happen.

To do that it's going to take one "true believer" in every county (3200 counties) of the US to get the ball rolling. But, if this idea gains traction, expect some of those initial people to be "plants" whose real purpose is to make sure things go "wrong" rather than "right".

Vva takes that into account by enlisting the aid of many people from various "minor parties" who should be chomping at the bit to do this, as it will finally give them what they've wanted for so long, a chance!

So get going. I'm a 66 year old retiree and know little of this new fangled thing called "the Internet", but many of you do. My suggestion would be to come up with a short, yet powerful synopsis of what Vva is and how it works. You work on that and so shall I/mac

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Permalink Reply by Chancy Yardbird on June 23, 2012 at 2:55pm

I have read all I find on the Vote verification systems being used and proposed including your Vva. Exit polling included. The data quality requirements are critical.

You obviously know that the states each have in their constitutions and statutes stuff regarding "secret vote" protections and polling place politicking restrictions. The secret vote should not be confused with the union voting process DEBATE that's on going. The one we speak of is the Political only. Right? If so, I don't see those constitutional laws coming dowN for this November's election.

What I do see is time we have left to get boots on the ground as poll workers , polling place judges, and most importantly observers. And an effort to get out the vote. Like never before.

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Permalink Reply by pa mike on June 23, 2012 at 11:24am

We've got serious hurdles. I like the idea of hitting the pause button and holding off the elections, but there's no provisions for it in the Constitution. Unless we'd prefer the Martial Law concept that would follow? Don't think that would be a big selling point.

I'm thinking out loud so fill in the blanks! If these RNC lawsuits cause a stir, and are found in violation, could that take Romney out of the race? If so, hasn't every GOP nominee officially stepped out except Ron Paul? On the other side, if we get just a little traction over OBummer being in-eligable, do the Dems have no nominee to officially run or stay in office? However, I'm not sure of the cutoff date for all party nominees. And not discounting a surprise third party either. The timing of events has me puzzled. Can the Dems still nominate Hillary the traitor at the last minute? Which I suspected long ago. She has always had high approvals in her party! And Bill has been positioning for that to happen.

So best case scenario, while fighting for a fair election. Who's likely to be "legally" on the ballot? Only Ron Paul running un-opposed. Or a Hillary vs Paul election.

To summarize, if the ballot is tainted, who cares about a fair election? Maybe drastic measures are more appealing? Sorry if I took the thread off on a tangent. It's supposed to be about Fraud. Which is all around us.

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Permalink Reply by Chancy Yardbird on June 23, 2012 at 11:45am

They do know that we have video tapes, don't they?

FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE
June 20, 2012
Contact: Jason Doré
225-389-4495

Lawsuit Filed Against LAGOP

The Republican Party of Louisiana announced today that a lawsuit has been filed in U.S. District Court in California's Central District by more than 100 Ron Paul supporters and self-proclaimed delegates to the Republican National Convention.

The suit, filed against the Republican National Committee and Chairman Reince Priebus and many state Republican parties across the country along with their respective chairmen, including Louisiana, alleges that the binding of national convention delegates is illegal under federal law and claims numerous violations of party rules.

The Republican National Committee has agreed to provide a joint defense for all parties listed in the suit. "We view the suit as completely frivolous but one to which a serious response must be made," said RNC Chief Legal Counsel John R. Phillippe Jr..

"We have joined with the RNC to fight this ridiculous, frivolous lawsuit. This is just another feeble attempt by Paul supporters to undermine the rules and systems in place, and we are going to take this very seriously," said LAGOP Executive Director Jason Doré
http://www.dailypaul.com/241300/lagop-joins-forces-with-rnc-to-figh...

I think law suits like these happen during every primary and should be looked at more realistically instead of how we're led to by the fake media.

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Permalink Reply by Patriot Girl on June 23, 2012 at 10:18pm

www.truethevote.com
this is what each and every one of us can do to fix voter fraud.

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Permalink Reply by mac Sperry on June 24, 2012 at 12:24am

Of www.trueththevote.com - - This website advocates more of the same thing we've had since we witnessed on TV our national elections being stolen in Florida in 2000. More "Observers", "educating voters", "poll watchers", "mobilizing election workers" - - All of this has been done and is being done ad nauseum by many website-based 501c3 non-profits and all to no avail.

It has been shown by these people over an d over again, after the elections are over and the crooks have taken office, that vote fraud is rampant; yet, nothing happens. Enough already!! Einstein once quipped (to paraphrase) Insanity can be defined as, doing the  same thing over and over again and expecting a different result each time.

It's time for a change. It's time for Vva/mac

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